ARDC issues

[Marshy]

Whilst I'm solving the world's problems, I thought I should share this here. I emailed this to my contact at the ARDC on Tuesday. Receipt acknowledged but no other reply yet.

Hi ...,

Hope you're well!! We had a pretty shit day on Friday, and another shocking start-line crash on Saturday. I was hoping to ask for your assistance in these matters; specifically about who at ARDC I could speak to to try and resolve these issues.

Firstly, the most important thing: The motorcycle starting grid. Start-line incidents are becoming commonplace at St George race events, and whilst there are many causes, it is exacerbated by the 4x4x4 grid structure. All FIM approved tracks have long ago moved to 3x3x3 for rider safety. In 2014 Motorcycling Australia recommended (but decided they couldn't make mandatory) that tracks move towards 3x3x3. Phillip Island has long been 3x3x3, with very large spacing between rows, and start line incidents are rare. Even the little Broadford circuit has since implemented the 3x3x3 layout.

The problem is the rows are too full, and too close together, and if a competitor stalls on the grid, other riders don't have time to see or avoid the stationary rider. Horrendous injuries ensue. A rider died on the grid at SMSP a couple of years ago (I was there), and I have also witnessed significant critical injuries including on Saturday. I haven't heard for sure, but one rider from this weekend was not expected to survive.

At ASBK at SMSP this year, ASBK marked up their own 3x3x3 grid, separate to the painted 4x4x4 grid that ARDC supply. So it's an easy change to make, and it has the potential to save lives and reduce the instances of serious and critical injury. It's a no-brainer. How do we make this happen?

Secondly, the ARDC PP days are a joke for bikes. Apparently we had 90 bikes on Friday, yet we were treated like second-class citizens. By 4pm, we had only completed 7 laps. Our first session was stopped due to an accident (unavoidable, of course) after only one flying lap, and the session was declared. Yet in a later closed car session in which a car dropped a massive amount of oil at turn 2, causing nearly an hour delay, the session was restarted, FOR ONE CAR! Only one car circulated for the next 15 minutes.

The car that dropped an engine-worth of oil travelled the length of the main straight with massive amounts of white oil smoke billowing from behind the car, but instead of pulling off into the old drag strip, it continued all the way to turn 2, where it then deposited the entire oil contents on the racing line in the middle of the corner. Not only did it delay the day by an hour whilst the oil was cleaned up, it also meant many ours of work for the ARDC cleanup crew after hours to get the track ready for motorcycle racing on the weekend, and it meant that the motorcycles were disadvantaged by the sight of clearly visible oil marks and white cleanup dust for the rest of the weekend. There should be mandatory minimum scrutineering for non-professional racecars at ARDC PP days. Just having bought a LS2 licence and rocking up in a shitty old road car does not automatically give you the right to destroy everyone else's day by having a poorly maintained car that drops oil all over the circuit. There should also be significant punishment for anyone that ignores a black flag and stays on the track, dropping oil all around the circuit. Currently there's no punishment at all, and therefore no incentive for people to do the right thing.

Additionally, I understood that open cars were given the same conditions as bikes, that there had to be 10 pre-paid participants before a session was allocated, and yet on Friday there were only 4 open cars. We had 90 bikes sitting around doing nothing for most of the day, whilst 4 open cars had the track to themselves for an hour. Why was the pre-register condition for open cars changed?

Thirdly (whilst I'm on a roll), ride days next year are increasing by an unprecedented $50 per day. The upshot of this is to punish the regulars whilst discouraging the casual track day attendee, who will then go and endanger themselves and others by getting their need for speed satisfied on a public road rather than in the safe confines of a motor raceway. The track is a government asset, and should be made as easily available for the public to 'speed off the streets' as possible. Why has the ARDC raised track day prices so significantly, when the costs of providing the service have not risen by the same amount?

I look forward to your reply.

[Kris]

Nice one marshy

[Krackeye]

Very well worded and said Marshy. I just hope it's not a case of changes made too late for the poor bugger on the weekend. Here's hoping he makes it.

[Ruckos87]

Well said!!! Happy to support with an email of my own if needed.


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[KANGA]

Well fucking said Marshy.

[Mr.Ed]

*applauses*

I would also like to know why before a car event there's no bikes on their practice day but the opposite doesn't occur

[Marshy]

*applauses*

I would also like to know why before a car event there's no bikes on their practice day but the opposite doesn't occur

The short answer is nobody asked. The guy running the on-track activities on the Friday said "you've got enough bikes... you should be eligible for your own day".

[Mr.Ed]

Shit... well lesson learned

[Leezx10r]

Well said Nick, any reply?


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[Marshy]

Nup. Not a dickie bird.


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[Mr.Ed]

I hope both ARDC and race promoters look at the last weekend/practice day and realize that there's still a BIG number of racers/bikes out there and the sport can thrive if they get their sh#t together. 90 riders on a practice day is quite a few ppl but when you think of how many riders there were on St.George... and to think that just me, who hasn't even been to track much over the last 5-6 years, know at least another 10 riders who didn't make this meeting for one reason or another!

Motorcycle racing is not even too far from being great again, if they can work on making it just a bit more affordable and user friendly, the numbers are there. There's a big profit to made if you're not trying to get all you can get out of every single rider and are willing to listen and adapt.

Then again, I guess I'm just being an optimist.

[Nelso]

Hi ...,

....... I was hoping to ask for your assistance in these matters; specifically about who at ARDC I could speak to to try and resolve these issues.

............lot's of relevant points............

I look forward to your reply.

Reply:

Sorry mate. We don't actually give a shit about you bikers, as we are a car club. If you don't like it, tough.

PS, we have the monopoly and complete control, so there's fuck all you can do about it.

Regards, ARDC.

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[Turbo]

Reply:

Sorry mate. We don't actually give a shit about you bikers, as we are a car club. If you don't like it, tough.

PS, we have the monopoly and complete control, so there's fuck all you can do about it.

Regards, ARDC.

....................../´¯/)
....................,/¯../
.................../..../
............./´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
........../'/.../..../......./¨¯\
........('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
.........\.................'...../
..........''...\.......... _.·´
............\..............(
..............\.............\...

Sad but true!

[Marshy]

Sent a follow up email, got this reply:

Apologies for not responding earlier. I am just waiting to get together with a few stake holders to discuss points you raised in your email. I will be sure to respond shortly.

Thanks for your patience.

[Wolfie57]

Your email was spot on, let us know if we all need to send similar messages so we have weight of numbers ......

[Kimbo]

Stakeholders . I hate that fucking term ,

[Linden]

Stakeholders . I hate that fucking term ,

Paradigm shift is needed I suggest an All Hands Meeting with Outside The Box Blue-sky thinking on this Transitioning

[Marshy]

Paradigm shift is needed I suggest an All Hands Meeting with Outside The Box Blue-sky thinking on this Transitioning

I concur. We need to scaffold the game-changer, peel the onion, reach out on the strategic staircase, and where the rubber hits the road we need to leverage a helicopter view to harness the low hanging fruit whilst hitting the ground running.

[Turbo]

Steakeholders . I hate that fucking term ,

It's like... eat it already!

[Mr.Ed]

It's like... eat it already!

[Marshy]

I think you'd call this a 'win':

Hi Nick,

Once again apologies for not getting back to you earlier in response to your email.

I have spoken with internal staff here at SMSP with regards to some of the issues you have raised.

It has been decided that we will be marking up the starting grid with a 3 x 3 x 3 configuration – this will be actioned prior to the end of the year.

Just for your information the unfortunate death of that rider wasn’t due to the grid formation he had a medical episode.

Private practice – it was an unusually big day beyond what we had expected with not only a large number of bikes attending but also the other categories. Last private practice prior to a St George race meeting we only had about 30 riders so therefore envisaged about the same.

We understand your frustration of the time lost due to oil downs, accidents etc and have been trying to come up with alternatives on how the private practice days should be run. Whether it be timed sessions or bikes for the first 2 hours (or thereabouts) then cars etc. Any thoughts and or ideas that you have would be beneficial to making these days run more effectively.

Thankyou for your feedback and we hope to make the private practice days more enjoyable for all involved in the future.




My response:

Thank you kindly for addressing my concerns. I and my fellow bike competitors really appreciate your responsiveness to the issues raised.

Not to labour the point too much; I know the rider had a heart condition and suffered a massive heart attack, but I would make the point that the heart attack was caused by the start line accident. He was on borrowed time anyway, so nobody holds anyone responsible, but there you go. These things happen in motorsport! It’s risk minimisation, not elimination. We all appreciate you making the changes to the grid markings!!

Thanks for your thoughts on PP days. I’ll give it some thought, and poll the regulars for ideas, and get back to you. In general, we love them! Smoother-running days would benefit all, cars included.

The question about the significant price rise of track days would be good to also address. I understand there’s no competition to balance pricing against costs, but a 20% increase is just a little (actually 10 times) inflation. We want to encourage track day riders, not price access to the public resource out of reach. Please let me know the thinking behind the substantial increase.

Many thanks! It really is very much appreciated.

[Ruckos87]

Yes a win I'd call that!!! well done, and thankyou.

Smoother running days at ARDC??? how about some form of scrutineering or a fine/exclusion system for crapbox cars that drop oil. Two hrs in the morning might not be the best, if there are mechanical issue to sort, late starters or for unfit pricks like me.
Its a race track after all we need to share, but some of these cars wouldn't pass a pink slip, yet there allowed to race.

[Mr.Ed]

First, AWESOME work, Nick! The result is proof. Thank you heaps for taking the initiative.

Now, re ARDC practice days... It's not even that hard to implement some sort of deterrent even without the need for scrutineering... If we have learned anything from the Govt is how much we appreciate having our licenses. Well, MA/CAMS also hold our licenses. Create a mini point system (or strikes really, like 2 strikes for poor maintenance in one year and you're suspended) and everyone is a winner. Pretty simple to implement and keep track.

[Turbo]

This is fantastic news. Thanks heaps for taking the time to put this forward, Marshy!
It's very encouraging to see they're listening and making changes. Here's to rational thinking!!
Well done, again Marshy!!

[Marshy]

Thanks all. I must say I'm quite pleased. I've been thinking about it for a while, and it's actually really nice to have achieved a safety outcome for our sport

[dadat178]

Great work Nick. Thanks.

[Krackeye]

Great to know that you can get still get things actioned today. Well played Nick and thank you!

[Dunno]

Bravo Nick!

[Leezx10r]

Well done Nick as I said last night, you would have thought that maybe the ARDC, St George or even "MA" would be proactive enough to make these recommendations to help our sport, but thanks again for making this happen.

I will have a think with regards to ARDC private practice days, but maybe
1. "random" checks on all vehicles.
2. All groups must have a minimum of 8 entries to have their own group.
3. Optional practice starts


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[Kimbo]

Now , if we can get them to ban all brands of bike except for Aprilia , we will be ok

[stevem]

Well done Nick. One of the recent ARDC days I was at a guy in a car came onto the straight knowing he had a problem with oil smoke blowing everywhere and continued the full length of the straight through turn 1 and onto the grass. I complained to the guys at pit exit and was told " some of these guys don't know what they are doing". Maybe a bit more could be added into the riders/drivers briefing also to stress the dangers . I really like the laid back way these days are run compared to the old SMSP days , a middle ground would be good to achieve. Well done man.

[Nelso]

Well done Marshy. Awesome result!!

[Wolfie57]

Well done mate, good work! At least they are finally listening to us, let's see what we can agree to...

[zoidberg]

Top bloody effort Nick, thank you a bunch for pursuing them! Regarding the three by three grid spacing, them saying it will be actioned as of the end of the year, I'm assuming that will be the grid setup for the opening round in Feb? I mentioned this to Zara and Chris last night at the presentation, they were happy and surprised as they were going to limit the grids to 40 next year to try and avoid the same issue, but both felt the numbers wouldn't need to be cut down to 40 if the grid were indeed in the new format.

They have asked and mentioned the 3 x 3 to the ARDC recently and were told as it is not a FIM sanctioned track, it wasn't necessary.

[Mac III]

Excellent work Nick,
Serious response from the ARDC , not what I had expected.
Keep up the good work
Thanks !

[Marshy]

They have asked and mentioned the 3 x 3 to the ARDC recently and were told as it is not a FIM sanctioned track, it wasn't necessary.

I guess they didn't create a properly reasoned argument. To me, ARDC are at risk of being liable for start line injuries if they knew the FIM and Motorcycling Australia had both decreed and recommended, respectively, the change. If I were one of the recently injured and feeling litigious, I think there would be a strong case for negligence. But I'm not, so I'll just be thankful they've bowed to common sense and made the changes.

[Marshy]

I've been chasing up the price increase issue, and got a reply this morning. I tend to think (in a monopoly environment) that's the best we are gonna get, so I'm happy with that. They are still very open to suggestions about improving PP days....

I believe prices haven’t been raised for 2 years whilst wages, insurances, track hire etc have. I also believe that they will be putting on extra medical services to reduce stoppages on the circuit giving people more ride time.

[Phat3R]

Your suggestion that the Practice Day before a bike race meet is only bikes (as the cars do for theirs) was a good one.

Maybe start with a compromise if necessary that they need at least 50 confirmed.

And the cars have to make their numbers just like bikes do. The argument is simple fairness for all motorsports competitors by being treated the same.